If the Watchtower says it or prints it...
It's a lie.
JV
Juan Viejo2
JoinedPosts by Juan Viejo2
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3
Watchtower's stand on misquoting
by The JHWH ini remember reading an article, maybe from the 70's not sure, where wtbts condemned people who misquote people for their own purposes.. i'd be thankful if anyones remembers this and could post it here..
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Well, I talked with two active JWs about the latest understanding of the F&DS.
by Theocratic Sedition ini know a brother who went to the most recent annual meeting.
older brother, non-annointed, elder, wife a pioneer, and overall a pretty good dude.
he let me take a peak at the new awake dropping in 2013, which by the way i have to give credit where it's due as i like the new 16 page format.
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Juan Viejo2
My question on this subject of the Governing Body = Faithful Slave is directed to Steven Unthank and our friends in Australia:
During the Victoria child-abuse investigation, the Watchtower's Legal Department stated that the Governing Body was not an actual entity, but rather just a "theological concept." (Help me out here, Steve. It's been a while and I could not find my notes. Correct me if I got it wrong.)
If this is the case, then this is another situation where the Watchtower has said something publicly (as in court or to a news organization) and then within months either deny they ever said it or reversed themselves.
JV
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Movies You Watch Over & Over & Over
by 3acrewood inhave you noticed there are certain movies you just never get tired of watching?
what's does your list include?
here are some of mine (in no particular order as to favorites):.
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Juan Viejo2
I pretty much agree with everyone's selections. All very good movies. When my wife and I take a trip we usually bring along a few movies to watch along the way when nothing is good on the motel TV. In fact, we just did this very thing a couple of weeks ago. What is unique about this list is that it contains movies, that when they are on TV, we stop what we are doing and just watch them for awhile - in spite of how short a time it has been since we saw them last. Here they are in no particular order:
Tombstone (Kurt Russell and Val Kilmer)
Last of the Mohicans (Daniel Day-Lewis)
Mama Mia! (Meryl Streep)
The Commitments
Dirty Dancing (Patrick Swayze)
The Notebook (Ryan Gosling)
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Because of their length, we don't usually take these with us on a trip, but watch them at least once a year and stop to watch them when we see them on TV:
JFK (Kevin Costner)
Godfather I and II (Al Pacino)
Avatar 3-D (we have a 3-D TV)
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When I am just bored and want something to divert our attention for an hour or so:
Bullitt (Steve McQueen) - Me
Pretty Lady (Richard Geer) - My wife
We have probably 50 DVDs, but some we haven't watched in years - but the ones on this list are just about worn through, if that is possible with DVDs.
JV
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Maybe it's being blonde, but I need clarification on "new light"..
by diana netherton inam i correct in stating the the "new light" is now that the gb are the the fds as opposed to the.
and is that switch because the number doesn't match and some "deranged" souls.
are now partaking at the memorial?.
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Juan Viejo2
Read Cedars's article over at JWSurvey.org. He covers the whole issue as well as I expect it ever will be explained.
http://jwsurvey.org/cedars-blog/governing-body-says-we-are-the-faithful-and-discreet-slave
JV
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Apostates back in the days of IRC & Chat Rooms
by JustThatGirl007 ini used to be really active in the jw chat rooms on irc.
i was an op on several and i had my fair share of banning apostates.
lol).
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Juan Viejo2
I used to get on the Usenet frequently. There were some pretty good threads there until the spammers and pornographers took it over completely.
I often got into long arguments with OBVES (yes, our own "scatologist"). He/she would go on about how the Bible would show that every single day since Pentecost was significant and should be observed. I think the end of the world, according to OBVES, must have occurred at least 5,000 times since those days in 1998-2000 when he was doing his very best predicting.
There were a few good posters. Some were very reasonable and used logic in their appeals for all of us to reassess our beliefs. The Usenet was a good thing. It still exists, but its popularity and access is severely limited.
Now there is Topix and Yahoo!Answers. It seems that the spirit of the Usenet has possessed these forums and others like them. They still make for a few good reads, but for the most part have been taken over by JWs who prefer to copy and paste from the Watchtower CD rather than engage in real discussion.
JV
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A Note from Randy/Dogpatch (Freeminds)
by Lady Lee inthis past week randy was hospitalized.
he is now home recovering and has asked me to let you know that he will need a couple of days to recuperate.
in the mean time: if you have sent him emails or want to send him an email, it might take a couple of days for him to respond.. feel free to leave messages here for him.
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Video tribute to Oompa (Eric Reeder)
by cedars ini didn't know eric particularly well, and i feel terrible that i didn't reach out to him more or try to help him while i still had the opportunity.. i feel extremely helpless, but the least i can do is help others remember him who knew him better.. here is a video i've uploaded to youtube in his honor.... .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67a0imd6dng.
i hope it helps us as we mourn a much-loved member of this forum.. .
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Juan Viejo2
Cedars,
Because of my connections to you on other projects I've guessed that you truly had big heart and open mind for those who have been damaged by the abuse and loveless religion promoted by the Watchtower. I did not know Oompa at all and only read his commentary here on JWN. Obviously many others knew him personally and cared for him.
Your video was perfect and a beautiful statement of love. Thank you.
Eric Reeder is just another example why those of us who are actively exposing the sins of the Watchtower and trying to expose their hypocrisy must not stop. Until the rest of the world understands that there are hundreds just like Eric suffering unimaginable pain and even death because of this cult - we must continue to get the word out.
I get emails and comments on my websites every week asking for someone to help at all - any help at all. I do my best, but fail miserably in too many cases.
None of us will know whether a well-timed hug and some quiet time to just listen would have saved Eric. Some of us are just too far away to help. It's just a shame that anyone should ever suffer that much.
JV
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5 Reasons Why the DEAF Masturbation Video is different than anything before...
by BluePill2 inas some of you have noticed the asl video warning against masturbation (another guilt trip) is creating waves.
this is not small fry.
1. it is humorous - most topics (like other policies) are serious/depressing (blood, shunning, pedos).
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5 Reasons Why the DEAF Masturbation Video is different than anything before...
by BluePill2 inas some of you have noticed the asl video warning against masturbation (another guilt trip) is creating waves.
this is not small fry.
1. it is humorous - most topics (like other policies) are serious/depressing (blood, shunning, pedos).
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Juan Viejo2
Just in case anyone has doubts that the video is legitimate and its source is JW.org, here is the link one more time...
http://www.jw.org/apps/index.html?option=QrYQFVTrlBBX&selLang=ASL&selPub=732 (it's #22)
JV
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New MS - Looking for the "better" job
by nochoice inlong, long time lurker and great fan of the site - first time poster.
i am not sure if i am truly a lurker since that implies i am apostate-curious.
in fact, i have been mentally out completely for a long time, but still physically in like many of you.
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Juan Viejo2
nochoice - welcome to JWN.
While you're here and trying to sort things out, maybe you can answer a question I've had for some time:
In a typical Kingdom Hall congregation, how many elders and Ministerial Servants are there? Is there a minimum number? Is there a maximum number?
What are all of the "servants" positions called now?
When I was a JW (back when dinosaurs still lived among us) we had about 6-10 "servants" positions. There were no "ministerial servants."
Prior to 1953 there were the following positions in the Riverside, California Central Kingdom Hall:
"Company Servant" (changed to "Congregation Servant" early that year) - (typically a lifetime position as long as the fellow was effective, popular, and met service requirements). We had an excellent, dedicated, and loving brother in that position [Ted Rogers].
"Assistant Company/Congregation Servant" - typically hardworking and effective. Took total charge when Congregation Servant was ill, on vacation, or otherwise unable to attend a meeting or other gathering.
"Theocratic Ministry School Servant" - ran the Thursday night ministry school, made assignments, and typically did most of the critiques after student presentations.
"Literature Servant" - managed the storeroom where literature was kept. Opened the literature counter before and after meetings, collected 3 cents per magazine and 25/50 cents for books and ordered additional supplies as needed. Provided handbills (ours had the dates and times of public talks printed on them) and other specialty items. Would also supply Pioneers with left-over or out-dated literature at no cost for their field work. Was responsible for the accounts for literature.
"Accounting Servant" (this was often a double-duty job for the CS or ACS). This was sometimes assigned to a brother with no particular skills, but married to a sister who was good at accounting and keeping the books. My mother was acting "accounts servant' when my father was assigned this position for a few months.
"Territory Servant" - some Kingdom Halls had a separate position for this, but ours was handled by the "Literature Servant." Handed out and logged the territory maps to "pioneers" and ...
"Book Study Conductors / Servants" - This was my first "elder position" assigned to me when I was just 20 years old. Conducted the Tuesday night Book Study held in a private home. Eight to twenty JWs and their families would meet at a private home for an hour to study one of the more advanced books. Would lead prayer, assign a reader, and (typically during the summer) would assign local streets to those who showed up for pre-study field service. Was also responsible for Saturday and Sunday morning field service management if located away from the Kingdom Hall.
Some Kingdom Halls had "Building Maintenance Servants," but these were rare. Our janitorial duty assignments were handled by the Assistant Congregation Servant. He'd post a calendar with cleaning dates and times assigned to family heads.
---- Jump to the present ----
When I attended a Memorial Service two years ago, the local Kingdom Hall seemed to have an elder's position for just about every well-dressed older man. It seemed like at least eight elders were involved in the presentation. One opened the meeting, introduced the song, and then invited another brother to say the opening prayer. He then introduced the main speaker (I assumed to be the COBOE). Two younger brothers adjusted the microphones and also carried hand mikes up and down the aisles. I counted four brothers on each main aisle (total of 8) who stood at the front and back during talk and then passed the bread and wine when that process began. There were at least ten brothers acting as parking attendants before and after the meeting. I believe an ASL meeting was taking place behind me, but I couldn't tell for sure. At the end of the meeting, the main speaker turned it over to the first "host", who then led the closing song and called on another brother to say the closing prayer. Before everyone was released (the Spanish congregation was coming in behind us), he turned the meeting over to another brother who made some announcements about the special talk that was scheduled for the following Sunday. After the meeting was dismissed, a nice younger brother (in his 30s) introduced himself and his wife. He then pointed out his wife's father and uncle (not otherwisde involved in the meeting) and told me that both of them were elders. I'm guessing this congregation of about 125 must have had at least a dozen elders and maybe ten Ministerial Servants.
So - can anyone help me out here? What is the typical configuration for elders and MSes in an average KH now? I've looked through all of my current books and the WT CD, but I can't find anything definitive.
JV